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On the record is brought to you 
by Steve

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and Adele Dufilho

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San Antonio is a fast growing,

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fast moving city with something 
new happening every day.

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That's why each week we go 
on the record with Randy Beamer

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and the newsmakers 
who are driving this change.

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Then we gather at the reporters 
roundtable

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to talk 
about the latest news stories

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with the journalist 
behind those stories.

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Join us now 
as we go on the record

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with Randy Beamer.

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Hi, everybody,

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and thank you for joining us for 
on the Record again this week.

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I'm Randy Beamer, 
and this is a special edition

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of On the Record 
at the end of the year.

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We are going to be going through

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the top five stories 
as chosen by a couple of

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our special guests, 
the top journalist

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in San Antonio, who also come in 
and talk about the stories

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we have.

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Andrea Rush, 
who is local government reporter

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for the San Antonio 
Report and editor in chief

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Sanford Nel, one of 
the San Antonio Current five.

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Number 
five the spate of dog attacks.

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Just this month,

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you wrote a story about what 
the city is doing,

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raising some minimum fines 
about dog attacks,

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trying to make a difference 
in this problem.

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Yeah.

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So we're going on year 
two of dogs as a theme

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for story of the Year in San 
Antonio.

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We've had now, 
I think our seventh,

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dangerous attacker or seventh,

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mauling of this year 
in San Antonio.

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But this started back 
in, February of 2023,

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when we had an 81 year 
old veteran

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who was mauled to death 
by some dogs in San Antonio.

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That really started.

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Yeah, started 
this whole discussion.

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And so then this past month, 
we finally reached

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some conclusions at City Hall.

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They're going to increase fines 
for if dogs are off of a leash.

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And they instituted a $1,000 
minimum

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fine for 
if your dog bites somebody.

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And you were talking about 
how this is such a long problem

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that we have had not just since 
February of 2023, but decades.

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Yeah.

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I mean, this is 
this is a situation where,

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you know, animal care services 
went before the city, council

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during the budgeting process 
and said,

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look, you know, 
we know that there's

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just this problem going on.

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We we're we're not even able

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to respond to all of the calls 
we get about dangerous dogs.

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I mean, and it was 
it was alarming the,

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the lack of response 
that they admitted

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that they, they had they

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so they were understaffed, 
something.

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Like one third of critical calls 
get a response.

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The rest maybe get a letter 
some day.

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Yeah.

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Right.

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And so, you know, the budget, 
they got a 33% budget increase,

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which was the biggest 
of any city department.

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And these kind of things 
raise the question,

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why in San Antonio do 
we continue

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to have problems like this 
that just snowball and we don't

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take serious steps 
about solving them until it's

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really kind of reached 
this cataclysmic level.

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It's like, you know, 
when Brackenridge Park,

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we don't maintain 
Brackenridge Park for decades,

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and then suddenly everybody's 
surprised when,

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you know,

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we're having to chop down trees 
and repair these crumbling,

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you know, walls 
that are in danger

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of spilling over and, 
you know, hurting somebody.

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Although we did 
last year after the first,

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dog attack, 
the fatal dog attack,

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go to the legislature, 
and it looked like

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they were going to have 
a solution.

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Yeah, but in,

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as a nod to that, maybe this is 
a San Antonio specific problem.

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They came up 
with some legislation,

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and all of the other Texas 
cities said

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they maybe you guys do 
your own thing,

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San Antonio, 
get your own dog problem.

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They ended up

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narrowing that legislation down 
to where it would only,

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if applicable, to San Antonio.

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And then Governor 
Abbott vetoed it and also said,

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I don't think that 
criminalization of dog owners

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is like the way to solve 
your problem.

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Come back 
with some other answers.

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Do you think this one,

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the fines will go 
to the legislature or something?

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We'll go to the legislature 
and maybe

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knock down those fines or not, 
because Abbott's not real happy

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with any kind of local control 
over anything, really.

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But a big piece of this.

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The most recent rules

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that the city came up with 
was an allowance

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that if you have a neighbor 
with an issue with a dog,

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you can report their dog 
and get it

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on the dangerous dog list, 
which means that it has

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to have certain issues to go out 
with.

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A muzzle has to have 
a certain regulations.

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And they said you can do that 
anonymously

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because they didn't want people 
to feel intimidated

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by reporting their neighbor. And

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you would 
still eventually find out

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if you go to court 
who accused you and your dog.

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But the next step,

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they're saying is, 
take that to the legislature

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and see if it can be 
a permanently anonymous process.

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Animal lawyers are skeptical 
that this is the solution

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to this.

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Other cities are skeptical that.

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This is maybe Ken Paxton or Greg 
Abbott saying due process.

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That's not you're not giving 
a dog owner a due process.

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What do you think?

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Yeah, this is a problem

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that has been snowballing for, 
for, for years, decades even.

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I have had friends 
come to San Antonio,

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stay in Airbnbs 
and up and coming neighborhoods

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and say, you know, 
I really love Dignity Hill,

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but damn,

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you got a lot of stray dogs 
running around San Antonio,

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a lot of people, people 
from other cities noticed this.

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And I think we 
for some reason have become,

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you know, you know, immune to it 
until it started,

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you know, it's 
still you still you saw,

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Ramone that had attacked 
and killed on the street

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in front of his brother.

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And a lot of what they say

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isn't stray dogs 
so much as people

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who own those dogs, 
just letting them loose.

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And that's what they hope 
this will crackdown on.

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Right.

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Well,

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I think 
that's part of the answer.

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But I also think education,

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I also think, spay 
neuter programs.

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I think I think if we're going 
to undo this amount of neglect,

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it's going to take a action 
on a lot of fronts for.

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And now the number

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four story in San Antonio 
for 2024, the charter review

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and the charter amendments 
passing in November.

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And that is going to have, 
a little bit of an impact

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on how much the mayor makes, 
how much city

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council makes, 
and also on the city manager,

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because that was somewhat 
controversial, years ago.

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Tell us about the charter 
amendments and and the review.

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Yeah.

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I mean, there were six of them 
that came up,

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and they proved to be 
surprisingly non-controversial

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for the most part. Right?

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I mean, voters passed 
all of them,

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the, the although, it's 
worth pointing out that the,

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the pay raises 
and the term limit extension,

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both of those passed by 
just north of 50%.

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So those barely 
passed. The rest of them,

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pretty overwhelmingly passed,

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in the big one, 
I think, was the, you know, the,

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pay raise that we saw for mayor, 
city council, city manager.

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Of course, there was, 
you know, the fire union,

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initially convinced 
voters to pass a,

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you know, a punitive measure 
that was designed hitting back

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against the city manager,

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Cheryl Scully, who was a city 
manager, as a personal thing.

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Oh, yeah.

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They were in a fight over 
a union, over a labor contract.

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And that was sort of their way, 
it hitting back at her.

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Ultimately, that led to her 
leaving city government.

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And it put, not only, 
pay limits on what

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the the city manager can earn, 
but also term limits.

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So Eric Walsh,

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who was the current city

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manager, looked like 
he would have to leave in 2027.

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Now that voters have approved, 
that change, he doesn't have to.

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Leave and he could also 
make more money.

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And so this all ended with, 
you know, a conversation about,

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will we really need to restore,

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you know,

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put the power back in the hands 
of the city council,

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just like a company's 
board would have the power

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to hire and fire their CEO.

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That's 
that's the right way to do this.

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And then came back with a plan

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to give him a raise 
that would make him the second

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highest paid city manager 
in all of Texas.

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That would be a a $87,000 raise 
that they're going to consider

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at the next meeting.

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That would put him at $461,000, 
still less than Cheryl

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Scully was making, 
but more than everybody.

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It's up 
to the city manager in Austin.

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But it seems like all 
they're all happy with him.

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And he, as I understand, I'm 
trying to remember

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when he was in junior high, 
he was planning

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to be city manager. 
He was like training himself.

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That's 
what he's always wanted to be.

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Well, and so I think six people 
or at least a half dozen city

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assistant city managers

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applied for that job 
when he was chosen.

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I'm sure some of them 
were thinking, he's

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going to hit this term 
limit in 2027.

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There's a job for me to be had. 
Not the case anymore.

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But also the, 
what they were going to pay

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the mayor when the charter 
review came out.

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First they were going to pay 
or they recommended

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paying the mayor and city

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council members 
more than they wound

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up on the charter review 
or the charter amendment.

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Right? Yeah. That's correct. 
Very dramatic.

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It was, they suggested $125,000, 
I think, for the mayor.

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And that the people who came 
for the charter review meetings

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were not happy with that.

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But the pay equity thing 
has been such, a sticky subject,

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even when it was just city 
council.

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City council 
got that recommendation

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from the Charter Review 
Commission and said,

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we need to pare this back down.

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But even amongst 
the ten of them,

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it was one of the most dramatic 
discussions of the year.

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What is fair pay in a city 
where there's so much need?

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And there were certainly some 
some name calling on the day

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as every.

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Yes, the three lawyers said, 
this is enough money.

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And everyone else. Yes. 
No, it's not.

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Including some of. 
The happier to work out.

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Yeah. Part time jobs 
while they're on city council.

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Yeah.

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And it goes back 
to, Phil Harshbarger

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when he first wanted 
to get people

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getting more than what was a $20 
a meeting or whatever,

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that they weren't 
getting anything.

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And people were saying, 
that's why

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we have people who have gone 
to prison and things like that

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on the city council.

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Yeah.

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Well, I think, 
I think you can look back at it.

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Another factor

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there in terms of the bad 
old days

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of some of that behavior on city 
council, it went in, 1991,

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they passed these, these,

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term limits 
that basically limited

246
00:09:53,766 --> 00:09:56,566
people to, to two year 
terms on council.

247
00:09:56,566 --> 00:10:00,333
And so you really had, you 
had, let's just say, some fairly

248
00:10:00,333 --> 00:10:02,833
unserious people 
running for that office.

249
00:10:03,900 --> 00:10:06,533
And, and consequently,

250
00:10:06,533 --> 00:10:11,866
you know, we saw that up 
to, to, to for two year term.

251
00:10:11,866 --> 00:10:15,233
And now it's, changed to two, 
four.

252
00:10:15,233 --> 00:10:16,633
Year term. That's correct.

253
00:10:16,633 --> 00:10:21,066
So they say they won't have to 
campaign nonstop to.

254
00:10:21,066 --> 00:10:22,966
Get a big raise, 
and they don't have to run

255
00:10:22,966 --> 00:10:25,966
for reelection as often. Three.

256
00:10:26,933 --> 00:10:29,000
And that does bring us to number 
three

257
00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:32,900
of the top stories of 2024 
horse drawn carriages.

258
00:10:32,900 --> 00:10:36,833
After being an issue again 
for decades, city Council

259
00:10:36,833 --> 00:10:39,833
just voted ten to nothing 
to phase them out.

260
00:10:39,833 --> 00:10:45,100
But over a period of five years, 
anyone surprised by that.

261
00:10:45,833 --> 00:10:47,400
Was the first Texas city 
to do it.

262
00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:48,700
Lots of cities across 
the country

263
00:10:48,700 --> 00:10:50,466
have been talking about this. 
Some of them.

264
00:10:50,466 --> 00:10:52,533
There is now a really active 
horse drawn

265
00:10:52,533 --> 00:10:54,666
carriage lobby 
that fights these things.

266
00:10:54,666 --> 00:10:56,200
They actually tried 
to pass legislation

267
00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:57,466
in the last two sessions

268
00:10:57,466 --> 00:10:59,366
to protect horse drawn 
carriages in Texas.

269
00:10:59,366 --> 00:11:01,566
They're passing 
that all over the country.

270
00:11:01,566 --> 00:11:04,400
They thought they were protected 
by that larger preemption bill

271
00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:05,766
that's sort of tied up in the 
courts.

272
00:11:05,766 --> 00:11:07,533
But this all started,

273
00:11:08,700 --> 00:11:10,366
what, two years ago now,

274
00:11:10,366 --> 00:11:13,033
if CCR was filed 
a council request

275
00:11:13,033 --> 00:11:15,866
for consideration 
to phase these things out,

276
00:11:15,866 --> 00:11:18,866
as Councilman Jalen Mickey 
Rodriguez and Councilwoman,

277
00:11:19,366 --> 00:11:22,966
Phyllis Vega on who she ended up 
being kind of a skeptic

278
00:11:22,966 --> 00:11:26,533
of this plan by the end after 
meeting with the the industry.

279
00:11:27,233 --> 00:11:29,633
She wanted the five year,

280
00:11:29,633 --> 00:11:31,200
phase out 
instead of three years.

281
00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:32,800
She ended up saying 
she wasn't going to vote for it

282
00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:34,900
unless they extended it 
to a five year transition plan.

283
00:11:34,900 --> 00:11:37,233
You had some council members 
at the last minute saying,

284
00:11:37,233 --> 00:11:39,300
I don't know that we've proven 
that there's a

285
00:11:39,300 --> 00:11:41,066
a transition plan 
for these folks.

286
00:11:41,066 --> 00:11:42,000
And this was some of the most

287
00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:43,600
dramatic council 
meetings of the year.

288
00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:45,800
They packed these meetings with,

289
00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:49,100
farriers and large animal 
veterinarians and her horse

290
00:11:49,100 --> 00:11:50,166
drawn carriage drivers

291
00:11:50,166 --> 00:11:52,333
to talk about their jobs 
and these horses.

292
00:11:52,333 --> 00:11:56,000
And it was hours and hours 
and hours of discussion on this

293
00:11:56,233 --> 00:11:58,533
over the course of two years 
that ended in this ban

294
00:11:58,533 --> 00:12:00,566
that, still five years down 
the road, doesn't

295
00:12:00,566 --> 00:12:02,600
start cutting back hours 
and stuff for three years, but.

296
00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:06,533
It also doesn't really give, 
you know, they had talked about

297
00:12:06,533 --> 00:12:09,533
phasing 
out or moving to, electric,

298
00:12:10,933 --> 00:12:12,633
carriages and things like that

299
00:12:12,633 --> 00:12:16,500
that wasn't brought up in this 
or I mean, they talk about that,

300
00:12:16,500 --> 00:12:19,533
but not put it in the, 
in the language, in the, in the.

301
00:12:20,266 --> 00:12:21,600
Report 
about all kinds of things.

302
00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:23,033
They thought 
about moving them to parks.

303
00:12:23,033 --> 00:12:24,700
They said, let's get them off 
city streets.

304
00:12:24,700 --> 00:12:26,433
They didn't wind up going that 
route.

305
00:12:26,433 --> 00:12:29,200
They thought about, the electric 
carriages,

306
00:12:29,200 --> 00:12:30,566
a transition 
to electric carriages.

307
00:12:30,566 --> 00:12:32,066
One of my favorite quotes 
from all of the city

308
00:12:32,066 --> 00:12:33,366
council meetings 
was the research

309
00:12:33,366 --> 00:12:35,100
they had done on horse 
drawn carriage drivers,

310
00:12:35,100 --> 00:12:37,366
and they were like, well, 
they're kind of,

311
00:12:37,366 --> 00:12:40,000
entrepreneurial 
and and they like horses.

312
00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,066
So I don't know if the electric 
carriages are going to work.

313
00:12:42,066 --> 00:12:45,066
But do you think, again, 
talking about the,

314
00:12:45,500 --> 00:12:47,900
campaigns coming up 
and a number of council members

315
00:12:47,900 --> 00:12:48,866
running for mayor,

316
00:12:48,866 --> 00:12:52,400
I don't believe many realize 
he abstained from this vote.

317
00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:54,700
I think. That 
it wouldn't be fast enough.

318
00:12:54,700 --> 00:12:56,566
We wanted them off the streets 
ASAP.

319
00:12:56,566 --> 00:12:59,900
So, but do you think that's 
going to affect

320
00:12:59,966 --> 00:13:01,866
what they do next on this?

321
00:13:01,866 --> 00:13:02,966
Or if they do.

322
00:13:02,966 --> 00:13:06,200
More, I would not be surprised 
if we saw them,

323
00:13:07,033 --> 00:13:10,400
moving towards approving 
some sort of electric carriages

324
00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:13,900
or some, 
some other sort of alternative

325
00:13:13,900 --> 00:13:16,933
transportation downtown 
that appeals to tourists.

326
00:13:16,933 --> 00:13:19,300
I mean, I do I do think 
you could make the case,

327
00:13:21,066 --> 00:13:24,166
that a number 
of the people on the, on council

328
00:13:24,266 --> 00:13:28,066
were less concerned about these 
things moving slow and being a,

329
00:13:28,633 --> 00:13:32,000
a potential traffic obstruction 
and more about the animal

330
00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:33,366
welfare part of it.

331
00:13:33,366 --> 00:13:36,366
I guess the question becomes, 
do you get enough support,

332
00:13:37,100 --> 00:13:37,666
for that?

333
00:13:37,666 --> 00:13:39,200
But again, with the legislature

334
00:13:39,200 --> 00:13:43,700
or session coming up in January, 
do you think the legislature

335
00:13:43,700 --> 00:13:48,100
will kill this idea 
of where you can, city can ban?

336
00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:49,833
If I had to guess, yes.

337
00:13:49,833 --> 00:13:51,233
They opened that carriage.

338
00:13:51,233 --> 00:13:53,400
Horse folks have openly courted,

339
00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:56,333
Dustin Burrows, 
the guy who wrote the the larger

340
00:13:56,333 --> 00:13:56,966
preemption bill.

341
00:13:56,966 --> 00:13:59,700
They're asking Ken Paxton 
for help on this.

342
00:13:59,700 --> 00:14:01,233
They're making an open appeal

343
00:14:01,233 --> 00:14:04,333
to people that agro 
tourism needs protection.

344
00:14:04,666 --> 00:14:07,566
And we've certainly seen,

345
00:14:07,566 --> 00:14:11,000
the Republican elected officials 
at the state level

346
00:14:11,566 --> 00:14:15,700
eager to punish 
big blue municipalities

347
00:14:15,700 --> 00:14:17,833
like San Antonio. 
And that's just been a theme

348
00:14:17,833 --> 00:14:19,466
that's been running 
for years now.

349
00:14:19,466 --> 00:14:21,333
And this will be the next 
kind of

350
00:14:21,333 --> 00:14:23,033
I don't want to say culture war, 
but it is.

351
00:14:23,033 --> 00:14:24,633
I've heard Texas.

352
00:14:24,633 --> 00:14:26,100
Turned into one

353
00:14:26,100 --> 00:14:26,700
in which it

354
00:14:26,700 --> 00:14:29,000
so surprised me from 
the beginning of this argument.

355
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:31,166
And then it turned out,

356
00:14:31,166 --> 00:14:31,800
you know, the

357
00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:33,466
there was a lot of animal 
welfare concerns,

358
00:14:33,466 --> 00:14:34,966
and the accidents 
involving horses.

359
00:14:34,966 --> 00:14:36,366
And they said, actually, 
there isn't

360
00:14:36,366 --> 00:14:37,733
any of that happening 
in San Antonio.

361
00:14:37,733 --> 00:14:40,766
We have one of the most highly 
regulated horse drawn carriage

362
00:14:41,433 --> 00:14:43,066
operations in the country.

363
00:14:43,066 --> 00:14:44,900
There's there's 
very few incidents here.

364
00:14:44,900 --> 00:14:48,266
And then it sort of changed 
the argument to horse,

365
00:14:49,533 --> 00:14:50,833
Exploitation, that

366
00:14:50,833 --> 00:14:53,833
it wasn't necessarily cruelty, 
but exploitation.

367
00:14:53,833 --> 00:14:54,366
Yeah.

368
00:14:54,366 --> 00:14:56,333
And I always think of 
one of the first conversations

369
00:14:56,333 --> 00:14:57,933
that I'd had about 
this was with them,

370
00:14:57,933 --> 00:14:59,666
the veterinarian for the city 
who said,

371
00:14:59,666 --> 00:15:02,533
we have so many mistreated 
animals in this city,

372
00:15:02,533 --> 00:15:03,733
I can tell you 
that the horses are one

373
00:15:03,733 --> 00:15:06,733
of the most regulated ones. To

374
00:15:07,500 --> 00:15:10,133
the number two story 
that had a development

375
00:15:10,133 --> 00:15:13,266
just this month as well 
is the missions

376
00:15:13,266 --> 00:15:16,733
baseball stadium 
and the complex around it.

377
00:15:16,733 --> 00:15:19,733
The last, I guess, obstacle,

378
00:15:19,833 --> 00:15:22,766
SARS, these parking lot.

379
00:15:22,766 --> 00:15:24,300
C-i-s-d said, okay,

380
00:15:24,300 --> 00:15:26,733
you can have it, 
but there's a deal on this,

381
00:15:26,733 --> 00:15:29,466
so it's still early, 
but you think the missions

382
00:15:29,466 --> 00:15:32,433
baseball stadium 
and that whole complex is a go,

383
00:15:33,933 --> 00:15:35,100
That's an interesting one.

384
00:15:35,100 --> 00:15:37,566
No, I mean, I think it it is,

385
00:15:39,066 --> 00:15:41,533
it seems likely that, you know,

386
00:15:41,533 --> 00:15:44,566
if the board at C-I-S-D 
approved it,

387
00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:49,366
that there it's going to be 
a serious attempt to negotiate

388
00:15:49,500 --> 00:15:52,500
that particular deal.

389
00:15:53,233 --> 00:15:56,433
We'll see if you know 
how much is too much in terms

390
00:15:56,433 --> 00:15:58,900
of what they're asking, 
but they already have sort of

391
00:15:58,900 --> 00:16:02,066
come back a little bit off of 
there are initial,

392
00:16:03,533 --> 00:16:06,533
demand because they had. A lot 
and they have leverage.

393
00:16:06,533 --> 00:16:08,400
They were the last piece 
of the puzzle.

394
00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:08,566
Yeah.

395
00:16:08,566 --> 00:16:09,400
Let's go backwards here.

396
00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:09,766
You ask

397
00:16:09,766 --> 00:16:12,033
if this is likely to happen 
of the two

398
00:16:12,033 --> 00:16:14,366
big stadium plans 
that we're talking about,

399
00:16:14,366 --> 00:16:16,166
this one, the developer, Weston

400
00:16:16,166 --> 00:16:19,133
Urban, already owns 
most of the property.

401
00:16:19,166 --> 00:16:20,966
City and county 
have been relatively on board.

402
00:16:20,966 --> 00:16:23,966
This last piece of land, 
this last parcel of a dusty

403
00:16:23,966 --> 00:16:25,900
parking 
lot owned by a San Antonio ISD,

404
00:16:27,166 --> 00:16:29,433
may or may 
not have been critical to it.

405
00:16:29,433 --> 00:16:31,433
That kind of came up 
at the school board because.

406
00:16:31,433 --> 00:16:32,900
The stadium. Stadium won't go.

407
00:16:32,900 --> 00:16:34,066
There isn't going to go there.

408
00:16:34,066 --> 00:16:37,700
It's the stadium 
funding relies on a lot of other

409
00:16:37,700 --> 00:16:41,133
development in that area 
to pay back the bonds.

410
00:16:41,366 --> 00:16:43,800
Needs the money from that 
development to pay off bond.

411
00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:45,333
So tax increment reinvestment.

412
00:16:45,333 --> 00:16:45,700
Yeah.

413
00:16:45,700 --> 00:16:48,300
So it is a careful balance 
of how this all comes together.

414
00:16:48,300 --> 00:16:49,433
But they own most of the land.

415
00:16:49,433 --> 00:16:51,600
So it seems like that 
one's a better bet

416
00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:55,533
than the other stadium project 
looming this year.

417
00:16:55,700 --> 00:16:59,000
The, the C-I-S-D superintendent 
we had in we were talking

418
00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:02,366
with him and he, I don't know 
if was on camera or off, said,

419
00:17:02,500 --> 00:17:04,066
you know, 
we have a lot of leverage.

420
00:17:04,066 --> 00:17:06,500
And they use that because they

421
00:17:06,500 --> 00:17:09,966
they got a whole lot aside 
from a lot more money

422
00:17:10,166 --> 00:17:12,100
than the land 
is worth currently. Right.

423
00:17:12,100 --> 00:17:13,166
They had really it wasn't.

424
00:17:13,166 --> 00:17:15,800
They asked for 20 times 
the value of the land currently.

425
00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:17,133
That is what one developer said.

426
00:17:17,133 --> 00:17:19,166
And they were criticized 
for being,

427
00:17:19,166 --> 00:17:21,333
exploitive of this process.

428
00:17:21,333 --> 00:17:24,666
The, the they took a lot 
of criticism for their asks.

429
00:17:24,666 --> 00:17:27,566
And in the end, 
they got some of them.

430
00:17:27,566 --> 00:17:28,700
They didn't get some of them.

431
00:17:28,700 --> 00:17:30,433
Interestingly, 
the tough thing on their list

432
00:17:30,433 --> 00:17:33,366
that they wanted was affordable 
housing promises.

433
00:17:33,366 --> 00:17:36,066
Well, and, 
and and that is interesting

434
00:17:36,066 --> 00:17:39,200
because, I mean, 
we have seen despite the,

435
00:17:40,733 --> 00:17:43,566
you know, 
city leaders continued,

436
00:17:43,566 --> 00:17:46,333
statements about we understand 
San Antonio has an affordable

437
00:17:46,333 --> 00:17:49,066
housing crisis, and we're doing 
something about it.

438
00:17:49,066 --> 00:17:52,466
Here is an example 
where you have a a low cost.

439
00:17:52,466 --> 00:17:55,633
It's not technically classified 
as an affordable housing.

440
00:17:55,633 --> 00:17:58,400
So factory 
apartments. Have. Torn down.

441
00:17:58,400 --> 00:18:01,833
But they are affordable 
housing units downtown.

442
00:18:01,833 --> 00:18:02,200
And there

443
00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:05,766
aren't very many affordable 
housing units downtown at all.

444
00:18:06,033 --> 00:18:09,033
And they're basically 
going to raise this property,

445
00:18:09,033 --> 00:18:10,433
move those people out.

446
00:18:10,433 --> 00:18:12,133
And I think.

447
00:18:12,133 --> 00:18:13,933
But there's no real timeline 
on that yet.

448
00:18:13,933 --> 00:18:14,866
Right?

449
00:18:14,866 --> 00:18:17,800
There is a timeline, 
but it's a few years and

450
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:18,433
but before

451
00:18:18,433 --> 00:18:21,433
before the entire complex goes, 
it's going to basically be,

452
00:18:21,566 --> 00:18:24,566
as I understand it, knocked down 
into two different phases,

453
00:18:24,666 --> 00:18:27,533
but they're already 
sort of were,

454
00:18:27,533 --> 00:18:30,366
you know, people 
that started moving out

455
00:18:30,366 --> 00:18:33,500
and one of the issues we saw 
was it the city said.

456
00:18:33,500 --> 00:18:35,133
And Weston Urban 
said, we're going

457
00:18:35,133 --> 00:18:38,200
to give you 2500 bucks 
to cover your move out,

458
00:18:38,466 --> 00:18:41,166
and we're going to set up this 
help this nonprofit to

459
00:18:41,166 --> 00:18:42,600
sort of coordinate things.

460
00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:45,766
Meanwhile,

461
00:18:45,766 --> 00:18:47,333
some people 
have already moved out

462
00:18:47,333 --> 00:18:49,566
and they're saying, 
where's my money?

463
00:18:49,566 --> 00:18:52,633
And alas, the city and Weston 
Urban are saying, well,

464
00:18:52,633 --> 00:18:55,266
you know, 
it was all contingent upon us,

465
00:18:55,266 --> 00:18:56,666
getting this deal 
moving forward.

466
00:18:56,666 --> 00:19:00,100
And and here is here's 
the essay question mark over it.

467
00:19:00,100 --> 00:19:02,966
So we can't really pay you 
until that gets resolved.

468
00:19:02,966 --> 00:19:03,433
But they did

469
00:19:03,433 --> 00:19:07,633
get the seat on the, 
San Antonio Housing Trust Board.

470
00:19:07,633 --> 00:19:07,933
Yeah.

471
00:19:07,933 --> 00:19:11,266
So strange, right, that a school 
district wants to be involved

472
00:19:11,266 --> 00:19:12,500
that involved that level

473
00:19:12,500 --> 00:19:14,233
of involvement 
in affordable housing.

474
00:19:14,233 --> 00:19:16,466
But they have had to close 
schools this year.

475
00:19:16,466 --> 00:19:20,333
They see their student, 
their, school aged population

476
00:19:20,333 --> 00:19:23,333
shrinking in this in the 
the urban core.

477
00:19:23,500 --> 00:19:26,600
And it's led to school closures 
that were widely unpopular

478
00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:28,133
that they took a ton 
of criticism for.

479
00:19:28,133 --> 00:19:30,433
And so it's a really interesting 
argument

480
00:19:30,433 --> 00:19:31,833
happening at that 
school board meeting this

481
00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:34,233
week about why

482
00:19:34,233 --> 00:19:36,100
affordable housing 
is become their interest.

483
00:19:36,100 --> 00:19:39,666
But but if you 
if you have that exodus, I mean

484
00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:43,200
that's a school age children 
you know. Yes.

485
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:44,500
It's not just downtown, it's

486
00:19:44,500 --> 00:19:46,900
in their whole district 
as there are a lot district.

487
00:19:46,900 --> 00:19:47,600
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

488
00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:51,466
I mean, I think, I think it's, 
I think it's easy to see why

489
00:19:51,466 --> 00:19:53,233
there's some concern there

490
00:19:53,233 --> 00:19:55,800
from the, from the trustees 
about losing affordable

491
00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:58,933
housing in their district 
and having kids moving out.

492
00:19:59,266 --> 00:20:02,200
I do I do think it was 
interesting, though, that,

493
00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:03,566
you know, we kind of,

494
00:20:03,566 --> 00:20:06,233
saw city council 
in people at the city level

495
00:20:06,233 --> 00:20:09,233
put the cart before the horse 
in that they basically had this

496
00:20:09,466 --> 00:20:13,066
this council vote in October 
wasn't right.

497
00:20:13,266 --> 00:20:14,600
What they said 
there was a deadline

498
00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:15,866
for the Major League Baseball.

499
00:20:15,866 --> 00:20:17,800
Had this deadline that.

500
00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:20,833
But, you know, the past the 
the team was going to explode

501
00:20:20,833 --> 00:20:22,533
and everything 
was going to be terrible

502
00:20:22,533 --> 00:20:25,033
if we didn't hit this deadline 
and have a deal. And,

503
00:20:25,033 --> 00:20:27,600
you know, so the city Council 
voted to approve this thing.

504
00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:28,800
And then we realized, oh,

505
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:30,933
they haven't done a deal 
with that c-i-s-d.

506
00:20:30,933 --> 00:20:34,633
And it turns out that's trickier 
than some people thought, and

507
00:20:35,133 --> 00:20:38,800
that's relocating people out 
of, the soap factory.

508
00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:40,800
That's a little trickier 
than we thought to.

509
00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:41,933
Yeah, it just seemed like

510
00:20:41,933 --> 00:20:45,166
there was this eagerness 
to get this deal done by what

511
00:20:45,166 --> 00:20:48,133
I think a lot of critics would 
argue is an artificial deadline.

512
00:20:48,133 --> 00:20:50,000
Well, and to your point, 
did you ever in your

513
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:51,366
in your newsroom's reporting,

514
00:20:51,366 --> 00:20:55,833
see evidence of the MLB 
threatening to relocate them?

515
00:20:55,866 --> 00:20:57,333
No, I don't know that 
we ever saw a letter or.

516
00:20:57,333 --> 00:20:59,133
No. In fact,

517
00:20:59,133 --> 00:21:03,666
you know, my my, staff writer 
Michael Kalas was going around

518
00:21:03,666 --> 00:21:06,666
talking to people on council, 
talking to city staff, talking

519
00:21:06,700 --> 00:21:07,900
to the team,

520
00:21:07,900 --> 00:21:10,833
talking to Weston Urban, saying, 
where did this deadline

521
00:21:10,833 --> 00:21:11,433
come from?

522
00:21:11,433 --> 00:21:14,700
Where's the document from MLB 
that says that

523
00:21:14,700 --> 00:21:17,833
there is this October deadline 
on on getting a deal done.

524
00:21:18,033 --> 00:21:21,266
Miraculously, nobody 
could come up with that document

525
00:21:21,466 --> 00:21:27,033
or even clearly articulate 
how that came to be. One.

526
00:21:28,466 --> 00:21:29,000
And that brings

527
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:33,700
us to our top story of 2024, 
another stadium project

528
00:21:33,700 --> 00:21:35,233
that has also been shrouded

529
00:21:35,233 --> 00:21:38,833
in a lot more mystery 
than what we have heard so far

530
00:21:38,833 --> 00:21:40,366
about the missions 
baseball stadium.

531
00:21:40,366 --> 00:21:44,233
That is the awesomely named 
Project Marble.

532
00:21:45,100 --> 00:21:48,800
Yeah, this is the Mega Sports 
Complex idea.

533
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:51,700
People with the city, 
the Spurs, you know, chamber

534
00:21:51,700 --> 00:21:53,766
commerce types 
have been talking about

535
00:21:53,766 --> 00:21:55,800
in a hush hush fashion 
for months.

536
00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:58,800
And we finally got an unveiling 
of what that would be,

537
00:21:59,066 --> 00:22:00,900
a new Spurs arena downtown.

538
00:22:00,900 --> 00:22:03,366
It would be renovations 
to the aging Alamodome.

539
00:22:03,366 --> 00:22:07,400
Alamodome, 150,000ft² 
added to the Henry B Gonzalez

540
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:08,366
Convention Center.

541
00:22:08,366 --> 00:22:12,966
UTSA School of Hospitality 
would be constructed downtown,

542
00:22:12,966 --> 00:22:14,866
and we would turn the John Wood

543
00:22:14,866 --> 00:22:18,300
Courthouse 
into a 5000 seat concert venue,

544
00:22:18,666 --> 00:22:21,766
which rates the questions 
how many downtown concert venues

545
00:22:21,766 --> 00:22:23,933
do we really need in 
San Antonio and.

546
00:22:23,933 --> 00:22:25,733
Land Bridge, though 
this is another thing.

547
00:22:25,733 --> 00:22:27,433
It's kind of that's 
what they are.

548
00:22:27,433 --> 00:22:30,200
It seems like the Project 
Marvel, they're thinking outside

549
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:32,866
the box, 
the land bridge across 281.

550
00:22:32,866 --> 00:22:35,100
Project Marvel combined.

551
00:22:35,100 --> 00:22:37,866
You mentioned the land bridge 
that was

552
00:22:37,866 --> 00:22:41,266
because of a federal grant 
that is available to,

553
00:22:41,833 --> 00:22:45,266
help cities that were divided 
by highways that the the Biden

554
00:22:45,266 --> 00:22:46,066
administration offered.

555
00:22:46,066 --> 00:22:49,166
And so that somehow 
got thrown into, okay,

556
00:22:49,166 --> 00:22:50,100
we could use that money.

557
00:22:50,100 --> 00:22:51,566
So maybe that could be a land

558
00:22:51,566 --> 00:22:53,200
bridge 
that connects to Project Marvel.

559
00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:55,600
Then there was also something 
from the legislature

560
00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:57,933
that they offered 
some state money to renovate

561
00:22:58,900 --> 00:23:02,066
facilities like convention 
centers and concert venues,

562
00:23:02,066 --> 00:23:03,933
and so that it's some state

563
00:23:03,933 --> 00:23:06,433
money coming together, 
pieced together over here

564
00:23:06,433 --> 00:23:08,666
to make this one 
big patchwork of things,

565
00:23:08,666 --> 00:23:11,233
but it makes it so that there's 
a lot more places

566
00:23:11,233 --> 00:23:13,600
where things could fall apart 
from the outside looking in.

567
00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:14,833
We don't even have a price 
tag for it

568
00:23:14,833 --> 00:23:16,600
because it's money from here, 
money from there.

569
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:20,433
And yeah, I mean, I think the 
the thing that's driving this

570
00:23:20,433 --> 00:23:25,166
to some degree is this the Spurs 
have an aging facility.

571
00:23:26,033 --> 00:23:29,033
At some point we're going to 
have to think about, you know,

572
00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:32,600
what, what kind of facility 
are they going to be playing in?

573
00:23:33,500 --> 00:23:35,000
How is that going to be funded?

574
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:37,666
But I think what you're 
also seeing is a concern,

575
00:23:37,666 --> 00:23:39,900
in San Antonio, 
that a lot of big cities have

576
00:23:39,900 --> 00:23:41,366
and that is, downtown's

577
00:23:41,366 --> 00:23:43,866
have not really recovered 
since the pandemic. Right.

578
00:23:43,866 --> 00:23:46,600
Everybody got sent home to work.

579
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:49,600
Some of people have come back 
and we've been seeing, you know,

580
00:23:49,833 --> 00:23:51,433
a lot of vacancies downtown.

581
00:23:51,433 --> 00:23:54,066
And then a lot of cities 
have gone with these,

582
00:23:54,066 --> 00:23:54,900
you know, sports

583
00:23:54,900 --> 00:23:56,766
districts, 
right, with the notion

584
00:23:56,766 --> 00:23:58,766
that if you put a whole bunch 
of stuff together,

585
00:23:58,766 --> 00:24:01,833
you have this critical mass 
and it generates all this,

586
00:24:02,166 --> 00:24:05,633
you know, economic development 
and all this, this, this new,

587
00:24:05,966 --> 00:24:10,000
you know, stuff going on around 
it that revitalizes an area.

588
00:24:10,366 --> 00:24:12,466
Although I think a lot of,

589
00:24:12,466 --> 00:24:15,766
people who study those things 
would say the jury's still out.

590
00:24:15,766 --> 00:24:18,766
Whether that stuff really works, 
there are a lot of,

591
00:24:19,500 --> 00:24:22,600
economic consultants 
that go around telling you, oh,

592
00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:25,866
it's going to have this sort of 
generational generator effect,

593
00:24:25,866 --> 00:24:28,866
and it's going to result 
in all these jobs being created.

594
00:24:28,866 --> 00:24:32,900
And if you talk to other 
economists on the academic side,

595
00:24:32,900 --> 00:24:34,400
they'll say, 
this is all a bunch of smoke.

596
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:34,800
And what do you.

597
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:36,700
Think 
about the local reaction to this

598
00:24:36,700 --> 00:24:37,566
and what that's going to be?

599
00:24:37,566 --> 00:24:39,500
It's different 
than the baseball stadium

600
00:24:39,500 --> 00:24:41,933
because that's a tax increment 
reinvestment zone.

601
00:24:41,933 --> 00:24:45,433
Everybody knows or believes 
it'll be fees and taxes.

602
00:24:45,433 --> 00:24:48,333
That doesn't hit me 
as a property tax owner,

603
00:24:48,333 --> 00:24:51,333
but the Spurs we don't know 
about.

604
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,066
The early conversation 
does involve

605
00:24:53,066 --> 00:24:55,400
some public funding, 
which you've got groups

606
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,166
that specifically opposed public

607
00:24:57,166 --> 00:24:59,600
funding for private development, 
that.

608
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,266
Even if it is separate fees 
and not property tax.

609
00:25:02,266 --> 00:25:03,766
Yes, but have said that 
they will fight

610
00:25:03,766 --> 00:25:04,833
this thing to the death

611
00:25:04,833 --> 00:25:06,933
if if that if it involves 
public funding.

612
00:25:06,933 --> 00:25:08,000
But that's coming 
from the county.

613
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:09,266
And I think to take it 
one step further,

614
00:25:09,266 --> 00:25:10,000
of all the pieces

615
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:11,433
that would need to align 
for this,

616
00:25:11,433 --> 00:25:14,033
the county County judge 
Peter Sacchi has said,

617
00:25:14,033 --> 00:25:17,133
okay, a key ingredient of this 
is that we find a use

618
00:25:17,133 --> 00:25:19,400
for the Frost Bank center 
on the east side

619
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:21,533
that was supposed to spur 
the development there.

620
00:25:21,533 --> 00:25:23,833
We've got this 
tentative bus line

621
00:25:23,833 --> 00:25:27,300
that could go east west 
and connect to that,

622
00:25:27,733 --> 00:25:31,200
but without a plan in place 
for how to redevelop

623
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:33,566
and find a good use 
for that Frost Bank center,

624
00:25:33,566 --> 00:25:34,766
they're not willing to 
contribute.

625
00:25:34,766 --> 00:25:37,800
County money hasn't 
been a plan to do that yet.

626
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:39,300
They're going to put together 
some demands.

627
00:25:39,300 --> 00:25:42,266
But even that bus line that was 
kind of a critical piece of it.

628
00:25:42,266 --> 00:25:45,266
Who knows what happens with that 
in this administration?

629
00:25:45,700 --> 00:25:48,266
The Biden administration put 
those bus lines in its budget.

630
00:25:48,266 --> 00:25:50,866
But who knows what happens 
with the Spurs as well?

631
00:25:50,866 --> 00:25:52,833
We have 
when getting better and better,

632
00:25:52,833 --> 00:25:56,200
and that could help 
push Spurs fans

633
00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:57,166
and a good part of the public.

634
00:25:57,166 --> 00:25:59,700
Yeah, I think that 
I think there will be a certain

635
00:25:59,700 --> 00:26:02,366
part of the population 
who's going to be enthusiastic

636
00:26:02,366 --> 00:26:02,866
about this

637
00:26:02,866 --> 00:26:04,600
because of the Spurs 
involvement,

638
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,333
but I would also like 
to bring us back to the

639
00:26:07,333 --> 00:26:08,633
The Charter review story,

640
00:26:08,633 --> 00:26:12,866
looked at the non-controversial 
parts of that amendment votes.

641
00:26:12,900 --> 00:26:15,566
Right. Let's have a city ethics 
policy update.

642
00:26:15,566 --> 00:26:18,133
You know, that passed 
pretty swimmingly.

643
00:26:18,133 --> 00:26:20,600
But when you look 
at the more controversial stuff,

644
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:23,200
getting the pay raise. 
About the money, yeah.

645
00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:26,900
People 
barely edge that up over 50%.

646
00:26:26,900 --> 00:26:27,300
I mean,

647
00:26:27,300 --> 00:26:29,066
the two most controversial

648
00:26:29,066 --> 00:26:31,633
charter amendments 
passed by just over 50%.

649
00:26:31,633 --> 00:26:34,600
And there was really not 
a whole lot of opposition.

650
00:26:35,100 --> 00:26:35,866
I mean, the fire

651
00:26:35,866 --> 00:26:38,866
union kind of came out 
and they kind of had some people

652
00:26:39,033 --> 00:26:41,700
standing at the polls holding 
signs and that sort of thing.

653
00:26:41,700 --> 00:26:44,966
But it was not the 
the forceful opposition.

654
00:26:44,966 --> 00:26:45,533
And you.

655
00:26:45,533 --> 00:26:47,966
You expect with a huge project 
like you.

656
00:26:47,966 --> 00:26:48,466
Would expect,

657
00:26:48,466 --> 00:26:51,600
but you are going to see that, 
I think, on Project Marble,

658
00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,666
and I think the margins 
are already razor thin

659
00:26:54,666 --> 00:26:56,300
for controversial stuff 
that gets put

660
00:26:56,300 --> 00:26:58,366
in front of voters. Let's see.

661
00:26:58,366 --> 00:27:01,433
And so you're going to be busy 
and making money

662
00:27:01,533 --> 00:27:03,466
and contributing to the tax 
base.

663
00:27:03,466 --> 00:27:06,433
Well, I'm I'm happy to have some 
job security that's all. Yes.

664
00:27:06,666 --> 00:27:08,466
And speaking of which, 
you can check out

665
00:27:08,466 --> 00:27:11,800
Sanford Nowlin, 
the editor in chief of the San

666
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:12,533
Antonio Current.

667
00:27:12,533 --> 00:27:16,166
I'd say current.com, and Andrea 
Drost, local government

668
00:27:16,166 --> 00:27:20,333
reporter 
for the San Antonio report.org.

669
00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:21,700
Thank you very much.

670
00:27:21,700 --> 00:27:24,266
And thank you for joining us 
for the special edition of

671
00:27:24,266 --> 00:27:26,033
On the Record. 
You can see this show again.

672
00:27:26,033 --> 00:27:27,733
You can watch 
any previous shows.

673
00:27:27,733 --> 00:27:30,200
You can see them 
at a number of previous shows.

674
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:32,666
I recommend 
that you can download podcasts.

675
00:27:32,666 --> 00:27:35,300
Just go to klrn.org 
I'm Randy Beemer.

676
00:27:35,300 --> 00:27:37,100
Happy holidays 
and we'll see you next.

677
00:28:19,500 --> 00:28:22,766
On the record is brought to 
 you by Steve and Adele Dufilho