1 00:00:01,900 --> 00:00:05,000 Franklin Foer: I want to pivot to talking about, from that grim reality to Mike 2 00:00:06,700 --> 00:00:11,666 Johnson's grim reality this week. I mean, ever since he became speaker, 3 00:00:13,733 --> 00:00:16,600 we've been talking about the way in which he's hanging on by his fingertips to the window ledge. 4 00:00:16,600 --> 00:00:20,033 You've been up on the Hill watching closely. 5 00:00:20,033 --> 00:00:25,033 Take us through his tumultuous week. Lisa Desjardins: What a week, what a day, 6 00:00:27,333 --> 00:00:30,733 even today, dramatic. Mike Johnson was not able to get through just the very first procedural 7 00:00:33,666 --> 00:00:37,533 vote on what may be the most important national security program, according to 8 00:00:37,533 --> 00:00:42,500 our national security officials, that we have. This is the Republican Party. They used to be 9 00:00:44,633 --> 00:00:47,833 the party of national security. And part of his problem was the man we've been talking about, 10 00:00:47,833 --> 00:00:52,133 former President Donald Trump, who said that that program, Section 702 of the Foreign 11 00:00:52,133 --> 00:00:57,100 Intelligence Surveillance Act, FISA, he said it was illegal, kill it, that it came after him. 12 00:00:59,233 --> 00:01:03,200 He was wrong. He was sending out in his Truth Social posts incorrect false information. He 13 00:01:05,300 --> 00:01:08,533 was confused or purposely being false about it. And as a result, 19 Republicans were emboldened 14 00:01:11,033 --> 00:01:16,033 to just block this procedural move, creating quite a kerfuffle, embarrassing the speaker. 15 00:01:18,066 --> 00:01:21,700 Now, I will say, in just today, he was able to thread the needle and get over another major 16 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:28,633 hurdle, able to defeat a poison pill amendment, 212 to 212, thanks to who? Progressive Democrats, 17 00:01:32,066 --> 00:01:37,066 who -- they were trying to beat the speaker. Anyway, it was a combination, a wild day. 18 00:01:39,166 --> 00:01:42,633 The speaker succeeded in getting through a FISA reauthorization, which, in his world, will come 19 00:01:44,733 --> 00:01:47,800 up for a vote again when, in two years, when I all hope, who will be president? Donald Trump. 20 00:01:49,900 --> 00:01:53,233 So, all of this is about a speaker trying to stay alive. He faces a potentially even 21 00:01:53,233 --> 00:01:58,200 worse week next week. We can talk about it. But Donald Trump is completely overseeing, in a way, 22 00:02:00,566 --> 00:02:04,166 all of his maneuvers. And he ended his week in Mar-a-Lago with Donald Trump, as you pointed out. 23 00:02:04,166 --> 00:02:06,400 Franklin Foer: Yes. Ryan Lizza: Trump is the 24 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:10,433 shadow speaker right now. I mean, the reason that FISA reform passed today is because they 25 00:02:12,700 --> 00:02:16,200 took it from five years to two years after Trump posted on social media about it. And that was -- 26 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:22,333 Franklin Foer: Even FISA, as a Republican obsession, wouldn't exist if Donald Trump 27 00:02:22,333 --> 00:02:27,200 didn't have this esoteric, as you say, somewhat incorrect idea about the role that it played in 28 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:32,200 the Russia gate scandal. And so it's all about kind of personal grievances from the past. 29 00:02:34,333 --> 00:02:37,966 Ryan Lizza: I mean, there's a serious group of left-right coalition of privacy advocates who 30 00:02:39,933 --> 00:02:43,666 wanted to reform Section 702 to create an additional warrant process when Americans 31 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:49,900 communications get swept up in foreign collection. That was the vote that was defeated on a tie today 32 00:02:52,866 --> 00:02:56,966 yes. That's not the case that Trump was making. Franklin Foer: Yes. Domenico, the culmination of 33 00:02:56,966 --> 00:03:01,933 Mike Johnson's week was that he goes and he kisses the ring and Mar-a-Lago. And it feels 34 00:03:03,900 --> 00:03:06,500 like when you're interpreting Donald Trump and his relationship with various people 35 00:03:06,500 --> 00:03:11,500 who were trying to curry favor with him it's all about reading the body language. 36 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:16,600 As you looked at that tableau today, how did you assess the body language? 37 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:21,266 Domenico Montanaro: I mean, this is all about Republican politics. And Mike Johnson, any 38 00:03:21,266 --> 00:03:26,266 speaker who's in a situation where at any point somebody on the right can try to take you out, 39 00:03:28,633 --> 00:03:32,433 can try to vacate -- file a motion to vacate, you need the sort of sunshine of Donald Trump in the 40 00:03:34,533 --> 00:03:38,866 Republican Party to say, this is my guy. Don't mess with him. He's okay. Or maybe not my guys 41 00:03:40,900 --> 00:03:45,066 totally, but he'll do for now, right? I mean, when you look at our poll, 42 00:03:45,066 --> 00:03:49,666 81 percent of Republicans have a favorable opinion of Donald Trump. It's -- you know, 43 00:03:49,666 --> 00:03:54,233 he's mostly unfavorable when it comes to the country at large, but that's why this 44 00:03:54,233 --> 00:03:59,200 is all about Republican politics and what can get through and whether Mike Johnson can keep his job. 45 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:03,900 Susan Glasser: Well, that's the thing, I mean, Donald Trump has become the ideology of the party. 46 00:04:03,900 --> 00:04:08,600 To Frank's point, it is not. There are principled argument perhaps on FISA that for a long time 47 00:04:10,866 --> 00:04:14,933 there have been privacy advocates. That's not what this about for Trump. Next week, there's 48 00:04:14,933 --> 00:04:19,933 going to be a fight for six months, essentially. The Republican, very slim majority in House of 49 00:04:22,300 --> 00:04:25,600 Representatives, has single-handedly blocked a popular bill funding U.S. assistance to Ukraine, 50 00:04:27,933 --> 00:04:32,933 $60 billion. The Ukrainian military is running out of air defense, 51 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:38,200 is run out weapons. Why? Because Mike Johnson is beholden to Donald Trump. He wouldn't be the 52 00:04:40,500 --> 00:04:44,033 speaker right now if Donald had not signed off on him becoming speaker. He is a completely unknown, 53 00:04:46,133 --> 00:04:50,466 completely politically inexperienced guy. He's an accidental speaker who wouldn't be 54 00:04:52,366 --> 00:04:54,933 speaker if it weren't for Donald Trump. And we all know it's not the Republican 55 00:04:54,933 --> 00:04:59,933 Party's ideology to bow down to Vladimir Putin. It is Donald Trump's ideology that has caused 56 00:05:02,266 --> 00:05:06,100 this stranglehold. And if they bring the bill to the floor, it would pass because there are enough 57 00:05:06,100 --> 00:05:11,100 Republicans who support American assistance in Ukraine. So, to me, this is classic test. 58 00:05:13,100 --> 00:05:15,833 And, you know, I think the message is not so great to Ukraine if the speaker ends the 59 00:05:15,833 --> 00:05:18,633 week in Mar-a-Lago with Donald Trump. Franklin Foer: Well, I want to just I 60 00:05:18,633 --> 00:05:22,100 would have turned to some one of the other subplots here in the story, which is that 61 00:05:22,100 --> 00:05:27,100 you have Marjorie Taylor Greene holding this threat to basically take him out of his job. 62 00:05:30,433 --> 00:05:35,433 And it seems like with Marjorie Taylor Greene and Mike Johnson are supplicants in front of Trump 63 00:05:37,666 --> 00:05:41,433 each -- can you just talk us through some of that? Ryan Lizza: Well, Greene is threatening to depose 64 00:05:43,766 --> 00:05:47,066 Johnson if he puts a Ukraine bill on the floor. Trump doesn't support a Ukrainian bill generally. 65 00:05:49,066 --> 00:05:54,066 So, Mike Johnson needed to basically get Trump's blessing to say, hey, you don't 66 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:59,666 support Marjorie's hair-brain scheme here to overthrow me, right? And Trump did do that. 67 00:06:02,033 --> 00:06:06,433 The great question, though, out of that meeting today in Mar-a-Lago is, what path does Johnson 68 00:06:08,433 --> 00:06:13,233 now have on the Ukraine supplemental? What promise did he get from Trump? He seems to 69 00:06:16,133 --> 00:06:21,133 have put the threat from Marjorie Taylor Greene at bay, at least to the extent that Trump signaled 70 00:06:22,433 --> 00:06:24,266 he doesn't want that. Franklin Foer: Yes. 71 00:06:24,266 --> 00:06:26,400 Ryan Lizza: Now, 72 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:29,400 did they make a deal on Ukraine? The question -- Lisa Desjardins: The possible path is alone, 73 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:33,666 which is what President Trump brought up today with Speaker Johnson. It was an interesting 74 00:06:33,666 --> 00:06:37,666 thing. And all this is still about sort of who is the Republican Party, where they go forth 75 00:06:37,666 --> 00:06:41,500 on Ukraine, on classic issues like abortion. And a quick note on that, I know you're saying 76 00:06:41,500 --> 00:06:45,400 grim reality, but on abortion there is a spectrum and there are many pro-choice, 77 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:50,400 pro-life (INAUDIBLE) who are in the middle you know who still think about life as well as the 78 00:06:52,666 --> 00:06:56,233 woman's right, and it's a complicated issue. Franklin Foer: Just quickly, before we wrap up, 79 00:06:56,233 --> 00:06:58,800 will this pass? You are a resident -- Lisa Desjardins: Ukraine? 80 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:01,233 Franklin Foer: Yes. Lisa Desjardins: It could pass. 81 00:07:01,233 --> 00:07:05,400 I don't think it happens next week right now. It could. It's -- Speaker Johnson is the only one who 82 00:07:07,533 --> 00:07:10,133 knows right now, he and President Trump, former President Trump are having a conversation on 83 00:07:10,133 --> 00:07:14,666 that. Right now, it feels like, no, not next week, but maybe two weeks, three weeks down the road. 84 00:07:14,666 --> 00:07:17,000 Ryan Lizza: And don't forget, if they open it up --